High Level Bridge Streetcar / ERRS

[Daveography]

While I would support donating at least one old U2 to ERRS for posterity, I'm not sure they would be able to operate it like the other streetcars given that the U2s we have aren't designed for street-boarding operation.

It's not an insurmountable problem, but probably more trouble than it would be worth to solve.

I also miss the pac-man ETS logo.

 

[roe_]

Some shots from today. They've been laying the new platform over the last week:

View attachment 295445

I know it isn't exactly the same thing, but what strikes me about this photo is how simple the infrastructure is for building this extension. Can you imagine if some of the old rail ROWs were resurrected for streetcars to restore connectivity between downtown and Calder or Alberta Avenue, for example? I would much rather have minimal stations and streetscaping with a quicker build-out.

Anyway, kudos to these volunteers for making this happen. This extension will be a huge profile boost for them to be on right on Whyte.

 

[Friendmonton]

This will be fantastic for the area. Will they add a controlled crossing over the street? Lots of traffic and I’d want them to cross safely. A few times I’ve experienced some close calls on the streetcar.

 

[Platinum107]

Also, hot take: the ETS pac man roundel Logo is 1000x better than the drab "let's make our logo just our name in Arial-Heavy-Bold-Italic, the more generic the better" thing we have now. I genuinely, not at all being crazy or funny here, think we could slap a silver Pac Man logo on our existing trains and buses and they would look more modern and characteristic than they do now. Bring back the Pac Man!

Omg I miss that whole aesthetic ETS had back then! I wish that with new LRTs and busses in the future they could make a new livery based off of the old one, with the diagonal lines and all that but in dark blue and grey instead of turquoise and white. I should try drawing some of this for you guys to see what I'm talking about...

 

[Macroman520]

All this talk about the U2s brings back memories. Luckily, I'm just old enough to remember them in their original paint scheme with the split-arrow logo, and don't forget the glorious New Look trolley buses too, before they were refurbished or taken out of service.

Ideally I would like to see the ERRS extended north, across Jasper Avenue, as far as 104 Avenue. The right-of-way still exists, and it would then connect MacEwan, the University (ish), and Whyte Avenue. I think it could fill a niche transporting university students between Downtown and Old Strathcona, and its northern terminus would then connect nicely with the valley line west when it's completed. Only problem I can see is crossing Jasper...

 

[_Citizen_Dane_]

I don't see crossing Jasper Ave as a problem, much more of an opportunity to make a big change in how we treat our Main Street.
Jasper doesn't need to be a thoroughfare, actually, it shouldn't.

It should be a destination street and having something disrupt traffic would create a big opportunity to rethink its role, as it would create more congestion, make people search for alternative routes and free Jasper Ave to have less car lanes, maybe a bike lane, larger sidewalks with patios for businesses, etc...

Yeah, it shouldn't be too big a problem. Jasper still dips from where the old CPR bridge was, so the clearance is there. Couple that with the fact that the shopping centre at 109th and Jasper was apperently developed to have a spot for a replacement bridge at some point. (If that was the case, I'd assume that's about here, where the pathway is, given that's approximately where the old bridge alignment was.)

I'll be honest though, I'll believe it when I see it. Plans have been in the works since 1992 and we still haven't got it:

If only we listened to these guys:

 

[ChazYEG]

Which is exactly was is happening from 97-124st with New Vision and Reimagine Jasper.

No, it isn't. What's happening is a half-baked initiative that isn't actually going to do much to change things.

Cars are still the biggest players, there's no priority to transit (what about simple dedicated lanes? Is it too hard to do?), benches and planters are not going to do much by themselves, the sidewalks are not nearly wide enough and there's nothing that makes pedestrians and patrons of the business on the street feel safer and more comfortable walking and seating in patios and, on top of everything, the IMBECILE decision of keeping the bike lanes (and bike racks) out of the main streets, Jasper above all, does nothing to help the businesses on these streets.

Essentially, it's make-up on a pig.

 

[Macroman520]

Yeah, it shouldn't be too big a problem. Jasper still dips from where the old CPR bridge was, so the clearance is there. Couple that with the fact that the shopping centre at 109th and Jasper was apperently developed to have a spot for a replacement bridge at some point. (If that was the case, I'd assume that's about here, where the pathway is, given that's approximately where the old bridge alignment was.)

Oh right, I forgot about the dip. It seems that the western edge of that shopping centre exactly follows the old track alignment, being offset several degrees from a right angle. Replacing a bridge where the right-of-way still exists doesn't seem half bad...

 

[IanO]

No, it isn't. What's happening is a half-baked initiative that isn't actually going to do much to change things.

Cars are still the biggest players, there's no priority to transit (what about simple dedicated lanes? Is it too hard to do?), benches and planters are not going to do much by themselves, the sidewalks are not nearly wide enough and there's nothing that makes pedestrians and patrons of the business on the street feel safer and more comfortable walking and seating in patios and, on top of everything, the IMBECILE decision of keeping the bike lanes (and bike racks) out of the main streets, Jasper above all, does nothing to help the businesses on these streets.

Essentially, it's make-up on a pig.

Oddly enough, I'd disagree.

The reality is that this is trying to balance an arterial with a Main Street and while I am vehemently opposed to hybrid cars, models, plans, it is going to be a vast improvement and ticks most boxes for most people.

We have great bike lanes E/W on 102 Avenue and 100ave.

Buses should get signal and priority pullout, but otherwise is fine with the new plans.

There will be room for cafe patios and even some extensions; we simply need to commit to being outside more often and more regularly.

 

[The_Cat]

Edmonton city council to consider $85K investment to lift High Level Line park proposal off the ground

Initial plans include activation of the upper deck of the High Level Bridge for pedestrians to walk alongside the historic streetcar.

edmontonjournal.com

 

[ChazYEG]

Edmonton city council to consider $85K investment to lift High Level Line park proposal off the ground

Initial plans include activation of the upper deck of the High Level Bridge for pedestrians to walk alongside the historic streetcar.

edmontonjournal.com

As they say, this will keep the project alive, which is awesome news, but just barely
I wish the city could divert part of its incentives towards this. Such a great potential to activate and connect parts of the city that need it so much!

 

[CplKlinger]

Edmonton city council to consider $85K investment to lift High Level Line park proposal off the ground

Initial plans include activation of the upper deck of the High Level Bridge for pedestrians to walk alongside the historic streetcar.

edmontonjournal.com

I'm not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand, it would bring a lot of life to the area and add a much needed pedestrian connection across the river there (the sidewalks are ok but get pretty sketchy at night, and they're narrow). On the other hand, the Edmonton Radial Railway Society, which operates the streetcars, already voiced concerns about not being consulted properly – considering that they'd suddenly have to deal with their tracks on a narrow bridge becoming a conjested pedestrian thoroughfare. I hope that they will have a seat at the table and get their concerns addressed. If both parties can work together on this, then this project would have amazing potential.

 

[IanO]

Work it out, work it out.

 

[cliffapotamus]

I'm not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand, it would bring a lot of life to the area and add a much needed pedestrian connection across the river there (the sidewalks are ok but get pretty sketchy at night, and they're narrow). On the other hand, the Edmonton Radial Railway Society, which operates the streetcars, already voiced concerns about not being consulted properly – considering that they'd suddenly have to deal with their tracks on a narrow bridge becoming a conjested pedestrian thoroughfare. I hope that they will have a seat at the table and get their concerns addressed. If both parties can work together on this, then this project would have amazing potential.

I agree with the sketicism. the first time i saw this proposal and read the brief, the only thought in my head was 'so NYC did this so we're copying it? that's where this is coming from?' I Don't really like this proposal, particularly running on top of the bridge. It jeopardizes the functions of ERRS, which a very special and unique part of Edmonton. Not consulting them worries me, and honestly i don't see how they could be accomodated safely, on top of a narrow, notoriously windy bridge without major infrastructure changes. Pedestrian access to the top level would also (most likely) wind up just as awkward as the accessing the lower level is now, or incur larges costs building ramps/stairs/whatever is needed to make it work. It all seems like a lot of money and effort to replicate something another city already has a more famous version of.

The High Level definitely needs some love. the existing sidewalks could be widened, both on the bridge on both sides, and on the south-end connections, for much cheaper, with the same result. this would leave ERRS to operate unimpeded, and frankly, save some money for the big issues on the route, like crossing Jasper Ave (i personally think we need a bridge there, as long as that hill on 110 Street is there that connection will be a barrier) and improving access to Whyte Ave. Like, the corridor could use some help, but do we really need to build a brand-new, fully exposed sidewalk on top of a notoriously windy bridge, when there's two existing sidewalks we could improve far more easily? can't we focus on the worse pinch-points?

 

[Platinum107]

the first time i saw this proposal and read the brief, the only thought in my head was 'so NYC did this so we're copying it? that's where this is coming from?'

You kiddin me? Ours would be so much cooler than the Highline (and really nothing like it if you actually compared them)

In all seriousness tho, I'm kinda shocked if it's true that the High Level Line Society hasn't had discussions with ERRS yet, much more that ERRS isn't a main player at the table on this project. It's literally the High-Level Streetcar for crying out loud! I think for this project to really go forward, that has to change and the alignment of the streetcar would have to be rebuilt along one side of the bridge. Then, to address the wind (and safety concerns) any glass barrier needs to be at least taller than the average person and heavily reinforced. Any which way they go, there are gonna be some tough logistical challenges with a project like this, but the payoff for Edmonton will be immeasurable if it's undertaken.