Manulife Place Renovations | 145.99m | 36s | AIMCo | MdeAS

What do you think of this project?

  • Total voters
    21
We are far from our goals of identification to put it mildly; and we dont do much interms of promotions to get people's mind frames to think of downtown. We make downtown inclusive to a genre style where families are absentees. Look at the clienteles that support HS. Very few live downtown...
 
So just to be clear, this $30m prodium reno is going to fully ramp up right around when the adjacent LRT construction is finishing up?
 
kcantor said:
maybe even at the same time, or followed shortly thereafter, by the the next set of renovations for ecc on the other side of the street...
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Anyone know the demographics and income breakdown for DT rn? I wonder if we just don't have enough people who would shop higher end living DT? My dad was a partner at PwC and most of his coworkers lived on the rivervalley in the west or SW. Very few lived DT. Maybe thatll change with legends, encore, etc. But im not sure a retail store can draw anyone away from the big malls in the suburbs. It needs to be more convenient to go to city center or Manulife than wem or others. And rn it seems like only people living DT would find that better.

Glad Manulife is getting the upgrade. Badly needed. Just hope they can land good businesses that are sustainable for DT.
 
The Avg. HHI for Downtown Edmonton is lower (~70k IIRC) due to many folks being single, but there are a decent amount of folks earning over 200k. The issue is less that then the lack of a great Downtown retail scene/cluster, online shopping and the impact of WEM. Simply put we need more residents, more professional jobs in the core and a better experience to drive more people here.
 
What is defined as needing a better experience?
 
thommyjo said:
Anyone know the demographics and income breakdown for DT rn? I wonder if we just don't have enough people who would shop higher end living DT? My dad was a partner at PwC and most of his coworkers lived on the rivervalley in the west or SW. Very few lived DT. Maybe thatll change with legends, encore, etc. But im not sure a retail store can draw anyone away from the big malls in the suburbs. It needs to be more convenient to go to city center or Manulife than wem or others. And rn it seems like only people living DT would find that better.

Glad Manulife is getting the upgrade. Badly needed. Just hope they can land good businesses that are sustainable for DT.
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Tableau Public

public.tableau.com public.tableau.com

Roughly 2,840 households make over $70,000. 1,270 households over $100,000. A good ratio walk/transit to work, but 1/3 also drive.

Anyone have the demographics for downtown Calgary? Their retail selection is much better than here, but I imagine their demographics are very different than us too. The notion that government workers (relatively well paid) are brown baggers exists for a reason.
 
Calgary's Downtown is ~ 4-5 times the size in terms of workers, a slight bit more in population (depending on where you draw the borders), but has a much more significant/worker demographic who wears suits/prof attire (HQ impact) and a much larger amount of people who spend on higher end items. They also have a much more significant international tourism impact which tend to spend.

That said, Chinook has had a similar effect to WEM on their scene.
 
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IanO said:
Clean streets, active storefronts, a feeling of safety and multiple other things to do when here.

MANY folks who used to shop at Manulife/Holt drive and drove out because they didn't feel safe on the street or didn't see another reason to stay.
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Holt was crap for a long time. That is why many people went elsewhere. HS is decent though.

I don't think we will ever see big expensive anchors in downtown Edmonton - our demographics just don't support those types of businesses. High income population in DT Edmonton is tiny. High end condos beyond some nice penthouses and the JW are non-existent. We can support a few smaller players like HS and the Helm.

As for feeling safe, there is low income people in every city on earth, especially downtown areas. Sure, we can work to mitigate and reduce that footprint, but it isn't going to go away. People in small towns will always flock to urban centers, because social supports exist in cities. I don't feel any less safe in Edmonton than I have in other cities I have lived in. Downturns in the economy will also always increase people living on the street and substance abuse. That is not something that downtown Edmonton can solve on its own.

Holt, Harry Rosen, Brooks Brothers, and now Simons are pretty big anchors for CORE. Sure, Chinook has pulled some business, but not all.
 
Thanks. Can't say I blame them really, it's not a great area to visit at the moment.

I was nearly robbed outside of Manulife on 101st in broad daylight in 2018, and things have become progressively worse since.
 
westcoastjos said:
Holt was crap for a long time. That is why many people went elsewhere. HS is decent though.

I don't think we will ever see big expensive anchors in downtown Edmonton - our demographics just don't support those types of businesses. High income population in DT Edmonton is tiny. High end condos beyond some nice penthouses and the JW are non-existent. We can support a few smaller players like HS and the Helm.

As for feeling safe, there is low income people in every city on earth, especially downtown areas. Sure, we can work to mitigate and reduce that footprint, but it isn't going to go away. People in small towns will always flock to urban centers, because social supports exist in cities. I don't feel any less safe in Edmonton than I have in other cities I have lived in. Downturns in the economy will also always increase people living on the street and substance abuse. That is not something that downtown Edmonton can solve on its own.

Holt, Harry Rosen, Brooks Brothers, and now Simons are pretty big anchors for CORE. Sure, Chinook has pulled some business, but not all.
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Holt was crap and barely reinvested in the store, especially the women's section (hello 1990 Eatons feel). That said, 'we' sure didn't give many reasons for people to continue to come for those kinds of items/stores.

People often mistake living Downtown for high income it seems when it is not the case. I remember when Sobeys opened with 5 Red Seal chefs, a giant lobster tank, caviar selections and product lines completely missing the mark.

As for safety, Edmonton feels materially different than Downtown Calgary, Sask, Tor, Ottawa, Mtl, Van and only really compares to Winnipeg in my recent (pre-COVID) experiences. So much so that people who really like Downtown have started to move away. We were making good progress until 2018 and then meth and other changes created a perfect storm. I would regularly walk home from work with more than 50% of the people I run into with mental health issues, aggressive folks or people visibly wearing gang colours.

Sadly, this has become more evident and worse since COVID.
 
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