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Edmonton City Centre Mall (Renovations) | ?m | 2s | LaSalle Investment Management

Its crazy to think that a decade ago City Centre Mall was quite a happening place. I know its not productive to compare Calgary to Edmonton, but what was made ECC so different from TD Square that caused it to flounder so much? Maybe it was already struggling a decade ago and businesses were just holding on? 🤷‍♂️
 
JMatt88 said:
Its crazy to think that a decade ago City Centre Mall was quite a happening place. I know its not productive to compare Calgary to Edmonton, but what was made ECC so different from TD Square that caused it to flounder so much? Maybe it was already struggling a decade ago and businesses were just holding on? 🤷‍♂️
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The office crowd largely supports the Core in Calgary, something Edmonton does not compare to and struggling to recover.
 
Yeah that is true. When I used to live downtown and go to ECC on the weekends (say around 2016), stores were open but the mall was really not that busy. Think it ties back to the number of folks who live and work in downtown Calgary versus Edmonton. Plus a lot of luxury retailers are concentrated in the Core (e.g., Harry Rosen, Holt, Brooks Brothers, Simons), so people have no choice but to go the Core for these stores whereas WEM has luxury retailers and parking....It's always WEM's fault! haha
 
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JMatt88 said:
Its crazy to think that a decade ago City Centre Mall was quite a happening place. I know its not productive to compare Calgary to Edmonton, but what was made ECC so different from TD Square that caused it to flounder so much? Maybe it was already struggling a decade ago and businesses were just holding on? 🤷‍♂️
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In my opinion, Kingsway.
Kingsway is too close to downtown, has way more options, and free parking.

TD Square gets the office and local crowds, also the botanical gardens brings people in, weekends included. Calgary also doesn't have a quality mall near their downtown (sorry north hill).

Personally I'd like to see ECC go inside out. Downtown doesn't need a mall, at least not one in its current form. Retail, yes.
More programming and activities are needed to draw people, but the building needs to be overhauled to present that, especially street facing.
 
That is very true regarding Calgary - Chinook and Market Mall are quite far away from downtown, and Chinook can be atrocious finding parking on busy days (granted there is a c-train connection).
 
JaayJR said:
In my opinion, Kingsway.
Kingsway is too close to downtown, has way more options, and free parking.

TD Square gets the office and local crowds, also the botanical gardens brings people in, weekends included. Calgary also doesn't have a quality mall near their downtown (sorry north hill).

Personally I'd like to see ECC go inside out. Downtown doesn't need a mall, at least not one in its current form. Retail, yes.
More programming and activities are needed to draw people, but the building needs to be overhauled to present that, especially street facing.
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A botanical garden at ECC? Let's do it!
 
How many screens does Landmark at ECC have? Just a thought that maybe a future plan is trying to make the main movie theatre be downtown (i.e., expand Landmark,. who move a theatre to an entirely vacant space) similar to how the Galaxy Theatre (not sure if that is still the name) is in downtown Saskatoon. I presume there would be sufficient underground parking at ECC to accommodate this?
 
Offworld said:
Somebody's in default, and the lender has had enough, hence the receivership appointment. And when something's in receivership, zero dollars get spent on the complex and unpaid vendors are screwed.

This one's going to be a bloodbath. I'm assuming equity < 0, and the lender is going to come out of this quite bruised. Get the popcorn out.
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ECC continues to maintain the asset, as I know vendors who continue to do work there even as of this week and area getting paid. They can't really afford not to maintain it.
 
JMatt88 said:
How many screens does Landmark at ECC have? Just a thought that maybe a future plan is trying to make the main movie theatre be downtown (i.e., expand Landmark,. who move a theatre to an entirely vacant space) similar to how the Galaxy Theatre (not sure if that is still the name) is in downtown Saskatoon. I presume there would be sufficient underground parking at ECC to accommodate this?
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Landmark has 9 screens at ECC.

On that note: I'm a loyal ECC moviegoer, but the lack of maintenance that Landmark is putting into that facility is a bit concerning, to be quite frank. I think they would draw a better audience if they reinvested into some infrastructure upgrades.
 
The_Cat said:
It's sad to see all of the commercial developments struggle downtown, save for the Ice District. ATB Place has less than half of the original retail outlets. Rice Howard Place is almost finished, and getting retailers may be difficult. Commerce Place is busy, but there are still some vacant spaces. Manulife/National Bank has pedestrian traffic, but sparse tenants.
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Much of downtown retail (not just this mall) struggled for several years during COVID when many people worked at home and seldom went to the office in the nearby towers. People have come back some in the last year or two, but retail has not much so far.

Having been here for decades, I sort of feel the last high point for downtown retail was around 2014 when the economy was doing well, there was more residential developments happening downtown and we still had some of the legacy retail to also draw some people downtown. Unfortunately, ICE District has done little or nothing to help most downtown retail, except restaurants or bars.

I sort of feel we may have hit rock bottom now after over a decade of decline in downtown retail. Sometimes when you hit rock bottom, it leads to reflection, change and improvement. I hope and feel this will lead us to more seriously deal with this issue and also consider some new and different ideas both for the mall and also for downtown retail in general.
 
I think the timing of the Ice District was interrupted with Covid, just like the other developments. The first blow to downtown seemed to happen with the drop in oil prices around 2016/17.
 
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