Connect Centre | 56.3m | 16s | ONE Properties | DIALOG

[Clearshades]

We have lost traditional retailing. As much as I on board with your thought, power centres and online have killed what we were accustomed to. It is not just an Edmonton thing as the whole USA and Canada are facing the same fate.

 

[Edmcowboy11]

Considering too, how many malls we have around this city we are somewhat lucky that we have any retailers in the core.

 

[David A]

Consumers are not agreeing with this and THAT IS THE PROBLEM.

Actually significantly more purchases are still made in store than on line.

I suspect work at home and COVID made buying online more attractive (and at times the only option), but with RTO and everything being open without restrictions or fear that will constrain its appeal in the future.

I'm not saying it doesn't work for some people, just not everyone.

 

[IanO]

Considering too, how many malls we have around this city we are somewhat lucky that we have any retailers in the core.

Edmonton has ~2x+ of retail space per capita and very little density = this.

 

[David A]

Over retailed in the suburbs, under retailed in the downtown core.

 

[occidentalcapital]

Edmonton has ~2x+ of retail space per capita and very little density = this.

Curious if this still holds with metro population at 1.5-1.6 mil. I remember this statement being made when the city was much smaller, and relatively little retail has been added since then.

 

[Greenspace]

^Millions of square feet of suburban retail has been added in the last 10-20 years. Our suburbs have grown over 50% in the last 25 years, much less dense city.

 

[TAS]

^Millions of square feet of suburban retail has been added in the last 10-20 years. Our suburbs have grown over 50% in the last 25 years, much less dense city.

Yes, and with that hasn't the amount of roads we've built and have to maintain grown by a third in that time-frame as well - maybe a little longer?

 

[occidentalcapital]

^Millions of square feet of suburban retail has been added in the last 10-20 years. Our suburbs have grown over 50% in the last 25 years, much less dense city.

Due to the higher density targets for new suburbs I think the growth in suburbs has resulted in increased average density, not decreased.

But the question was about retail space. Are there any current stats on per capita retail space?

 

[Greenspace]

I doubt that. 50% increase in suburbs would lead to an average decrease in density, not increase. But as our core densifies and more infill could partly offset this, I'm sure we're still way less dense than we should be.

 

[occidentalcapital]

I doubt that. 50% increase in suburbs would lead to an average decrease in density, not increase. But as our core densifies and more infill could partly offset this, I'm sure we're still way less dense than we should be.

Suburbs over the last 25 years (your timeframe) are significantly denser than the 1950-2000 suburbs. By, like, a lot.

 

[occidentalcapital]

Yes

See also: https://ici.radio-canada.ca/info/20...s-transport-commun-changements-climatiques/en

click on "Edmonton"

Total density has increased by 5% over the past 20 years.

 

[dunno]

Suburbs over the last 25 years (your timeframe) are significantly denser than the 1950-2000 suburbs. By, like, a lot.

Yeah, the main problem with our post-Y2K suburbs isn't the density levels. It's the car-centric design mixed with inferior build quality and aesthetic. I will say one thing Edmonton's newer suburbs do really well is MUPs that connect the irregular road patterns into what is in many areas, for pedestrians, a semi-grid. Even having walking trails is something most North American cities don't have in their new suburbs, or if they do, it's rather limited. Still, it's not like we're building Dutch-style suburbs, either.

 

[TAS]

I doubt that. 50% increase in suburbs would lead to an average decrease in density, not increase. But as our core densifies and more infill could partly offset this, I'm sure we're still way less dense than we should be.

I shared a graphic within the last year but I'm not sure which thread or where I saved it, but I definitely remember Edmonton was highlighted as the top Canadian city in terms of its increase in density.

 

[thommyjo]

There’s also the difference of tracking density by homes vs population.

A major part of the decrease in central community populations is simply household sizes. Averages of 4-6 are now 2-3. Partially due to empty nesters and widows. Partially due to smaller households in general and less kids in families these days. Partially due to housing stock/preferences of young couples and families…and where we have built great schools, rec centres, and family attracting amenities.

Areas like Lewis estates will likely see populations fall soon as it ages. Areas like Bonnie doon and Grovenor will likely see increases as elderly people leave/pass and new families move in and raise kids.

But densifying the old areas is key too. And duplexes/skinnies/garage suites won’t move the needle much. We need a few apartments in most old suburbs and lots of townhomes to really increase densities to that of new suburbs.