Hat at Five Corners | ?m | 24s | Cidex Group

[David A]

Retail follows people, but as per ^, it's struggling on 104st, Whyte, 124st.

Until WE make more of a concerted effort to support local, opt for something other than a mall even 10-20% of the time and not just buy online, this will continue.

It is an odd time we live in, where the people who live downtown seem to either have to drive some distance to a suburban mall or stay at home and wait to get items delivered, but not just go to a store down the street. However I feel as people continue to return to the office delivering items to homes during the day may not work so well any more.

I really don't feel there is a magic number of residential buildings before retail happens in an area, but if there was more development nearby that would help.

 

[Gus Haynes]

It is an odd time we live in, where the people who live downtown seem to either have to drive some distance to a suburban mall or stay at home and wait to get items delivered, but not just go to a store down the street. However I feel as people continue to return to the office delivering items to homes during the day may not work so well any more.

FlexDelivery/Pickup points seem to be the more likely solution to this for most folks than more brick and mortar general stores opening up downtown, I'm sorry to say. I think Return to Office mandates might make cafes and lunch spots a bit busier, but I'd be very surprised if they have much of an impact on other retail categories.

 

[CplKlinger]

Before BCM defaulted (or whatever happened on this project), their original proposal was actually for two towers, one on this site, and the other was supposed to be on the SW corner.

Which may have been for the better... an EDC member at the time said the tower designs reminded him of "low income projects in the UK"

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I feel stupid now, I didn't know what a live work unit actually was. I thought they were just designed to somehow be better suited for people working from home, and was so confused about why people always got so excited to see them.

 

[David A]

FlexDelivery/Pickup points seem to be the more likely solution to this for most folks than more brick and mortar general stores opening up downtown, I'm sorry to say. I think Return to Office mandates might make cafes and lunch spots a bit busier, but I'd be very surprised if they have much of an impact on other retail categories.

If so that would be unfortunate, because having more retail was part of what contributed to the vibrancy of downtown in the past. However, I'm not expecting a revival in retail to that of decades ago, just some improvement from what the situation is now. Delivery may continue to work for some, even if they are not at home as much, but it can also get convoluted with having to go to pick up things, waiting, having parcels taken or not delivered. Sometimes is is just as fast or easier to go to a store and buy it.

 

[archited]

Until WE make more of a concerted effort to support local, opt for something other than a mall even 10-20% of the time and not just buy online, this will continue.

That's definitely part of the story @IanO but retail is rebounding here in SoCal in pretty astounding ways. Developers need to do a better job of pre-planning Retail -- designing to fit the need instead of lazily carving out ground floor space with no sense of what would best work there and making an effort to find the right retailers before the building is even in the build-stage. The new Retail has to be clearly developed with some level of entertainment in mind (MINISO in WEM is a good example, but it can also be more sophisticated than that); it needs to come with a very strong internet presence with attention paid to website, customer incentives, and strong product door-to-door-delivery; and it needs to have a community bond with other Retail in the form of joint promotions -- the area Retail/Hospitality ecosystem needs to be strengthened. Again, a large part of the solution lies with the Developer and his/her design team -- there has to be more engagement on that level. Customers need to feel like they are truly missing out if they don't make an in-person appearance at the store.

 

[David A]

That's definitely part of the story @IanO but retail is rebounding here is SoCal in pretty astounding ways. Developers need to do a better job of pre-planning Retail -- designing to fit the need instead of lazily carving out ground floor space with no sense of what would best work there and making an effort to find the right retailers before the building is even in the build-stage. The new Retail has to be clearly developed with some level of entertainment in mind (MINISO in WEM is a good example, but it can also be more sophisticated than that); it needs to come with a very strong internet presence with attention paid to website, customer incentives, and strong product door-to-door-delivery; and it needs to have a community bond with other Retail in the form of joint promotions -- the area Retail/Hospitality ecosystem needs to be strengthened. Again, a large part of the solution lies with the Developer and his/her design team -- there has to be more engagement on that level. Customers need to feel like they are truly missing out if they don't make an in-person appearance at the store.

Yes, this has also got me thinking that part of what is different between downtown Edmonton and many other places is the relative lack of retail downtown here. People who live downtown may be not be getting items delivered only because of convenience, but because there are few nearby alternatives now. It is a bit of trip to IKEA from downtown or most of our bigger suburban malls.

So then perhaps we are in a better position to start fresh with new retail as described, although a lot of newer generic space built here in the wasn't designed for specific users in mind, which may be part of the reason why some of it has sat empty for so long.

 

[archited]

^ Exactamundo!