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CN Tower - Office to Residential Conversion - 111m (364')

kcantor said:
As posted elsewhere:

“Nobody asked me but this is an absolutely terrible configuration that fills the floor with terribly configured suites.

“For starters, there are way too many suites that are way too small - it's as if the direction was to maximize the number of units instead of maximizing their liveability and saleability/income.

“The floor works much better with larger suites properly laid out than what they show here - likely 12 rather than 16. While that caters to the mid/upper range in the market, it also provides better ratios for parking per suite etc. Furthermore, it reduces the number of kitchens and bathrooms and suite entry doors and demising walls etc. so it should reduce construction costs.

“Why would anyone back all of the bathroom plumbing fixtures against the corridor walls instead of ensuring that most of them are back to back which minimizes both construction costs and noise transmission?

“For residential use, 4 elevators is likely more than adequate. Why not decommission one bank entirely rather than having to upgrade and maintain them and reclaim the shaft for storage lockers on each floor?

“Eliminating that bank of three elevators would also allow access to the mechanical/service spaces on the floor to be accessed other than through the stairwells (which is likely an operational as well as a code-compliant pain in the a$$).

“Why recess the full width of the suites facing the elevators instead of simply recessing the suite entry doors in an alcove that would generate some visual interest with proper lighting etc.?

“Who in their right mind would place a tub/shower on a glazed exterior wall in a building where you have perimeter heat?

“Why woiuld you place a bedroom - where you want to be able to have things dark - on a glazed corner instead of your living space?

“Why in a two-bedroom unit would you make the master bedroom the smaller of the two?

“Why would you lay out a third of your one-bedroom units such that the bedrooms have no window?

“This is clearly a case, from a design perspective, where "less is both more and better"...”

I could probably expand on that but you probably get the point. :)
Click to expand...
Thank you!
 
kcantor said:
As posted elsewhere:

“Nobody asked me but this is an absolutely terrible configuration that fills the floor with terribly configured suites.

“For starters, there are way too many suites that are way too small - it's as if the direction was to maximize the number of units instead of maximizing their liveability and saleability/income.

“The floor works much better with larger suites properly laid out than what they show here - likely 12 rather than 16. While that caters to the mid/upper range in the market, it also provides better ratios for parking per suite etc. Furthermore, it reduces the number of kitchens and bathrooms and suite entry doors and demising walls etc. so it should reduce construction costs.

“Why would anyone back all of the bathroom plumbing fixtures against the corridor walls instead of ensuring that most of them are back to back which minimizes both construction costs and noise transmission?

“For residential use, 4 elevators is likely more than adequate. Why not decommission one bank entirely rather than having to upgrade and maintain them and reclaim the shaft for storage lockers on each floor?

“Eliminating that bank of three elevators would also allow access to the mechanical/service spaces on the floor to be accessed other than through the stairwells (which is likely an operational as well as a code-compliant pain in the a$$).

“Why recess the full width of the suites facing the elevators instead of simply recessing the suite entry doors in an alcove that would generate some visual interest with proper lighting etc.?

“Who in their right mind would place a tub/shower on a glazed exterior wall in a building where you have perimeter heat?

“Why woiuld you place a bedroom - where you want to be able to have things dark - on a glazed corner instead of your living space?

“Why in a two-bedroom unit would you make the master bedroom the smaller of the two?

“Why would you lay out a third of your one-bedroom units such that the bedrooms have no window?

“This is clearly a case, from a design perspective, where "less is both more and better"...”

I could probably expand on that but you probably get the point. :)
Click to expand...
Some very good points. One of the conversion challenges this building faces is with its small window sizes. Upscale suites typically have large windows to accommodate consumers' preferences and this project cann't offer that without impairing its cost structure. May be a reason why suites with smaller footprints were chosen.
 
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Out of Towner said:
Some very good points. One of the conversion challenges this building faces is with its small window sizes. Upscale suites typically have large windows to accommodate consumers' preferences and this project cann't offer that without impairing its cost structure. May be a reason why suites with smaller footprints were chosen.
Click to expand...
If anything the smaller windows can be an advantage as it provides more flexibility as to where interior partitions can butt to the exterior wall. It’s also worth noting that they’re only small when visually comparing them to curtain wall from the outside as the typical 5’ vertical mullion spacing isn’t as apparent.
 
If the developer wanted to go to the extreme expense, they could replace the exterior glass curtain wall with new that would give floor-to-ceiling views -- in my mind that is not a key problem; they need to improve the layout of units (that's more important IMO)
 
archited said:
If the developer wanted to go to the extreme expense, they could replace the exterior glass curtain wall with new that would give floor-to-ceiling views -- in my mind that is not a key problem; they need to improve the layout of units (that's more important IMO)
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The floor plans could be improved albeit the windows do have an influence on what economically can be done. Are the existing windows in a curtain wall or installed into the exterior wall structure? A completely different cost structure dependent on the construction method utilized.
 
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kcantor said:
If anything the smaller windows can be an advantage as it provides more flexibility as to where interior partitions can butt to the exterior wall. It’s also worth noting that they’re only small when visually comparing them to curtain wall from the outside as the typical 5’ vertical mullion spacing isn’t as apparent.
Click to expand...
I didn't see the size of the windows on the plan and will admit that I've never been inside the building to have a sense of their size in the space. Not huge like an upscale standard of today but presumably a reasonable size.
 
Out of Towner said:
Are the existing windows in a curtain wall or installed into the exterior wall structure?
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Based on reasonably detailed exterior photos, the windows appear to be a component in a curtain wall that is independent of the vertical white concrete ribbing, so the changeout would not be difficult if the desire was to have floor-to-ceiling windows for example -- just very expensive in both material and labor. The change would not be noticeable over the existing if the same shading was applied to the new curtain wall as per the existing. From the inside view the existing windows appear to be quite large (remember this was an office building with 9'-0" plus high ceilings (which I hope would be replaced with more expressive residential ceilings -- by code the ceilings in kitchen and bathroom areas would have to be moisture impermeable and washable -- so drywall painted would be my guess). None of this effort is going to accommodate poor functional layouts.
 
archited said:
Based on reasonably detailed exterior photos, the windows appear to be a component in a curtain wall that is independent of the vertical white concrete ribbing, so the changeout would not be difficult if the desire was to have floor-to-ceiling windows for example -- just very expensive in both material and labor. The change would not be noticeable over the existing if the same shading was applied to the new curtain wall as per the existing. From the inside view the existing windows appear to be quite large (remember this was an office building with 9'-0" plus high ceilings (which I hope would be replaced with more expressive residential ceilings -- by code the ceilings in kitchen and bathroom areas would have to be moisture impermeable and washable -- so drywall painted would be my guess). None of this effort is going to accommodate poor functional layouts.
Click to expand...
The facade does appear to be a curtain wall with glass and spandrel panels but curtain walls are non load bearing elements which eliminates concrete as the material in the vertical "ribbing." Too much weight. Possibly could be hollow metal. Quite sure that they're non structural though and only a decorative expression of Greek columns in modern terms.
 
Out of Towner said:
The facade does appear to be a curtain wall with glass and spandrel panels but curtain walls are non load bearing elements which eliminates concrete as the material in the vertical "ribbing." Too much weight. Possibly could be hollow metal. Quite sure that they're non structural though and only a decorative expression of Greek columns in modern terms.
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The “fins” are precast concrete.
 
kcantor said:
The “fins” are precast concrete.
Click to expand...
Are they? Ok. Guessing that their weight exceeds the capacity of a curtain wall to carry them and that they're fastened to the building's beam structure to relieve the vertical shear of stacking them and transferring the load into piers.
 
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