The_Cat
Senior Member
Another LRT video:
Valley Line LRT | TransEd/Marigold | City of Edmonton
- Thread starter Daveography
- Start date
ChazYEG
Senior Member
These pictures made my day!
thommyjo
Senior Member
I just don't get the timeliness on these when all over the world we see bigger projects done faster. Yes there are others with delays and long time frames, but there's also stuff like Hudson yards that was built in 3 years. One of the largest projects in NA this decade. In one of the most challenging cities to build in.
Why can we not train and hire more workers? Why are we always multiple years late? Why do we settle for this?
Everyone has struggled with the pandemic. Lots of companies have still got stuff done though. Makes me think trans ed either isn't motivated enough, or it's leaders aren't that great.
Are they even working overtime? In private companies people grind to meet deadlines. My friends at the city (eng department) still take every second Friday off, even if they're behind on projects they say...
Why can we not train and hire more workers? Why are we always multiple years late? Why do we settle for this?
Everyone has struggled with the pandemic. Lots of companies have still got stuff done though. Makes me think trans ed either isn't motivated enough, or it's leaders aren't that great.
Are they even working overtime? In private companies people grind to meet deadlines. My friends at the city (eng department) still take every second Friday off, even if they're behind on projects they say...
Edmonchuk
Active Member
Well, lets see what's going on with bigger projects in Canada:
LRT line in Eglinton pushed by 2+ years. Construction started in 2011!
LRT in Ottawa delayed by 15 months
All systems go: Ottawa’s Confederation LRT Line opens to passengers - Ottawa | Globalnews.ca
After a decade of planning and more than 15 months of delays, Ottawa's Confederation Line officially began carrying passengers along the electric train tracks.
globalnews.ca
LRT in Waterloo/Kitchener delayed by 2 years?
And what about the over the world:
LRT delayed in Tel Aviv by 3 years and over budget
Tel Aviv light rail faces delay of two years
An analysis of the project by the auditing firm Agis found that the government company building the line has already exceeded the NIS 15 billion budget NIS 5 billion.
www.haaretz.com
Anyway, don't wanna waste my time. Delays are no good but omg stop this silly whining.
Airboy
Senior Member
I don't think the west line will be as delayed. They are starting on the more difficult section already.
The_Cat
Senior Member
With President Biden’s move to ease supply chain bottlenecks, I wonder if Canada (and maybe Mexico) will follow suit. Given the nations are part of USMCA (formerly NAFTA), could all the ports work together?
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"Given the small profit margin of many construction contracts, a significant number of contractors may not be able to withstand the financial impact of COVID-19.
Contractors are experiencing increased costs for a variety of reasons. For example, there is a need for more thorough and frequent cleaning of offices and job sites, a greater supply of hand-washing facilities, and additional staffing requirements to learn new safety guidelines and to perform temperature checks, and other activities required or recommended to maintain a healthy work environment.1 Contractors are experiencing diminished labor productivity caused by a number of factors, including increased employee absenteeism triggered by illness, quarantine, issues with public transportation, lack of available childcare; the general effects of telecommuting; and the necessity of reduced on-site staffing or additional shift work mandated by new federal or local social distancing requirements. Materials may be more expensive to timely procure as a result of global manufacturing shutdowns (e.g., goods made in China), closure of ports, and general material transportation delays within the United States. Even if a bonded principal is weathering the storm, a bonded project may still suffer because lower-tier subcontractors and suppliers are simultaneously facing the same issues.
While operating costs are increasing, revenue streams are declining. Government or owner-imposed shutdowns have suspended some private and public construction work, curtailing anticipated progress payments needed to fund overall operations. While other projects are continuing, some nervous or financially-distressed upstream owners/general contractors are slowing down payment processing or declaring bankruptcy, affecting the contractor’s ability to adequately staff its own operations and pay lower-tier vendors. In addition to increased operating costs and payment delays, contractors may be subjected to delay damage claims from obligees when projects cannot be completed on schedule. The first place for principals and their sureties to look for some relief is in the underlying construction contract."
American Bar Association
"The full breadth and scope of the changes needed to address issues arising from the pandemic are still unknown, and this analysis is likely to continue to evolve until a vaccine or other curative measures are in place on a global basis.
These new realities touch almost every aspect of the construction process, and specifically such issues as: contract or project notices for default, scheduling and adjustments; project suspension, termination and reinstatement; Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) and workplace safety compliance; work force management; material, subcontractor and supply chain delays and impacts; risk management and insurance; claims avoidance or, alternatively, claims management; and the disputes process."
HKLaw
You can definitely hire and train more workers, however, that takes time. You offer someone a job, they give notice at their previous employer, which is typically two weeks. Onboarding is another week or two and then training, depending on the complexity of the job they have been hired to do can vary. Some specialized trades don't have an endless pool of talent. If those people are all employed or working on other projects, the education pipeline to hire more people in that sector is years, not months or weeks.
The pandemic has impacted every part of the business, not just one. When you develop a risk register, you typically plan for a few things to go sideways at any given time, not everything at once. Past project delays aren't a good indicator or comparison of this project, because past projects didn't have to deal with a pandemic that impacted every single part of the project. Generally speaking, Edmonton doesn't do too bad as far as on time delivery of project goes. That said, people never focus on the good, only the bad, so a narrative develops that Edmonton is always behind schedule on projects, which isn't really the case.
Transed has indicated that employees are working overtime on this project in the past.
Contractors are experiencing increased costs for a variety of reasons. For example, there is a need for more thorough and frequent cleaning of offices and job sites, a greater supply of hand-washing facilities, and additional staffing requirements to learn new safety guidelines and to perform temperature checks, and other activities required or recommended to maintain a healthy work environment.1 Contractors are experiencing diminished labor productivity caused by a number of factors, including increased employee absenteeism triggered by illness, quarantine, issues with public transportation, lack of available childcare; the general effects of telecommuting; and the necessity of reduced on-site staffing or additional shift work mandated by new federal or local social distancing requirements. Materials may be more expensive to timely procure as a result of global manufacturing shutdowns (e.g., goods made in China), closure of ports, and general material transportation delays within the United States. Even if a bonded principal is weathering the storm, a bonded project may still suffer because lower-tier subcontractors and suppliers are simultaneously facing the same issues.
While operating costs are increasing, revenue streams are declining. Government or owner-imposed shutdowns have suspended some private and public construction work, curtailing anticipated progress payments needed to fund overall operations. While other projects are continuing, some nervous or financially-distressed upstream owners/general contractors are slowing down payment processing or declaring bankruptcy, affecting the contractor’s ability to adequately staff its own operations and pay lower-tier vendors. In addition to increased operating costs and payment delays, contractors may be subjected to delay damage claims from obligees when projects cannot be completed on schedule. The first place for principals and their sureties to look for some relief is in the underlying construction contract."
American Bar Association
"The full breadth and scope of the changes needed to address issues arising from the pandemic are still unknown, and this analysis is likely to continue to evolve until a vaccine or other curative measures are in place on a global basis.
These new realities touch almost every aspect of the construction process, and specifically such issues as: contract or project notices for default, scheduling and adjustments; project suspension, termination and reinstatement; Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) and workplace safety compliance; work force management; material, subcontractor and supply chain delays and impacts; risk management and insurance; claims avoidance or, alternatively, claims management; and the disputes process."
HKLaw
You can definitely hire and train more workers, however, that takes time. You offer someone a job, they give notice at their previous employer, which is typically two weeks. Onboarding is another week or two and then training, depending on the complexity of the job they have been hired to do can vary. Some specialized trades don't have an endless pool of talent. If those people are all employed or working on other projects, the education pipeline to hire more people in that sector is years, not months or weeks.
The pandemic has impacted every part of the business, not just one. When you develop a risk register, you typically plan for a few things to go sideways at any given time, not everything at once. Past project delays aren't a good indicator or comparison of this project, because past projects didn't have to deal with a pandemic that impacted every single part of the project. Generally speaking, Edmonton doesn't do too bad as far as on time delivery of project goes. That said, people never focus on the good, only the bad, so a narrative develops that Edmonton is always behind schedule on projects, which isn't really the case.
Transed has indicated that employees are working overtime on this project in the past.
CaptainBL
Active Member
You say that until they find an unidentified, inexplicable concrete mass underneath the new WEM transit center that will be the excuse that sets this line back two years lol!
realkevbo
New Member
An update on the Ottawa LRT, perhaps they could have spent more time testing. I hope we do.Well, lets see what's going on with bigger projects in Canada:
LRT line in Eglinton pushed by 2+ years. Construction started in 2011!
LRT in Ottawa delayed by 15 months
All systems go: Ottawa’s Confederation LRT Line opens to passengers - Ottawa | Globalnews.ca
After a decade of planning and more than 15 months of delays, Ottawa's Confederation Line officially began carrying passengers along the electric train tracks.
LRT in Waterloo/Kitchener delayed by 2 years?
And what about the over the world:
LRT delayed in Tel Aviv by 3 years and over budget
Tel Aviv light rail faces delay of two years
An analysis of the project by the auditing firm Agis found that the government company building the line has already exceeded the NIS 15 billion budget NIS 5 billion.
Anyway, don't wanna waste my time. Delays are no good but omg stop this silly whining.
Confederation Line shutdown enters a fourth week as Council prepares to vote on calls for a judicial inquiry
The Confederation Line has been out of service since Sept. 19, when an LRT car derailed at Tremblay Station, damaging the car, the track, the station platform and LRT infrastructure.
ottawa.ctvnews.ca
David A
Senior Member
Ok, so we have company. Well, there are some people who smoke heavily and drink to excess, but that doesn't make it a better idea because other do it too.Well, lets see what's going on with bigger projects in Canada:
LRT line in Eglinton pushed by 2+ years. Construction started in 2011!
LRT in Ottawa delayed by 15 months
All systems go: Ottawa’s Confederation LRT Line opens to passengers - Ottawa | Globalnews.ca
After a decade of planning and more than 15 months of delays, Ottawa's Confederation Line officially began carrying passengers along the electric train tracks.
LRT in Waterloo/Kitchener delayed by 2 years?
And what about the over the world:
LRT delayed in Tel Aviv by 3 years and over budget
Tel Aviv light rail faces delay of two years
An analysis of the project by the auditing firm Agis found that the government company building the line has already exceeded the NIS 15 billion budget NIS 5 billion.
Anyway, don't wanna waste my time. Delays are no good but omg stop this silly whining.
There is not strength in numbers when it comes to repeatedly missing deadlines either.
Avenuer
Senior Member
The elevated guideway along 87 Avenue?
thommyjo
Senior Member
I remember taking a class on quality assurance and control in uni. Fascinating to see the difference between japan and other asian nations vs north america. Ford said the same thing as you when challenged about the quality of their cars. Yet toyota seemed to figure it out.Well, lets see what's going on with bigger projects in Canada:
LRT line in Eglinton pushed by 2+ years. Construction started in 2011!
LRT in Ottawa delayed by 15 months
All systems go: Ottawa’s Confederation LRT Line opens to passengers - Ottawa | Globalnews.ca
After a decade of planning and more than 15 months of delays, Ottawa's Confederation Line officially began carrying passengers along the electric train tracks.
LRT in Waterloo/Kitchener delayed by 2 years?
And what about the over the world:
LRT delayed in Tel Aviv by 3 years and over budget
Tel Aviv light rail faces delay of two years
An analysis of the project by the auditing firm Agis found that the government company building the line has already exceeded the NIS 15 billion budget NIS 5 billion.
Anyway, don't wanna waste my time. Delays are no good but omg stop this silly whining.
I refuse to settle for delays and cost overruns. Better can and should be expected. Stuff happens, I get it. But in 6 years, if you can't make up time from delays, that shows a lot. Lack of accountability and penalties.
This isn't like an experimental hyperloop thing. It's a low floor train that has been built all over the world. Yes, there are contextual pieces. But im tired of excuses from our city. We get taken advantage of constantly because tax payers have almost no power compared to shareholders...
Be better or get fired. That's how it works in most businesses.
Edmonchuk
Active Member
It's almost a generalization. Japan has its share of issues and is not perfect. But hey, you as a tax payer can very much use your power and vote for your mayor/city counsellor. Not sure what else you want. We don't live in a perfect world.
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cliffapotamus
Active Member
It's not the city mismanaging things though, in the case fo the Valley Line SE? it's Transed? isn't that a huge part of the P3 contract they have, that the city's oversight is severely limited? I recall that being a factor in the city having to hire external auditors to get updates on the line. The City itself isn't building either of these lines. how much affect do they actually have on planning?
I do have more faith that the West leg will be on time, because the timeline seems more realistic. 5-6 years to build approximately the same length of track as the SE sounds more reasonable, and seems to match what Transed was able to do. I think the 3-4 year Timeline Transed originally had was crazy.
I do have more faith that the West leg will be on time, because the timeline seems more realistic. 5-6 years to build approximately the same length of track as the SE sounds more reasonable, and seems to match what Transed was able to do. I think the 3-4 year Timeline Transed originally had was crazy.
The_Cat
Senior Member
I wonder how far along the commissioning is coming.