Massey Ferguson Building Redevelopment | ?m | 6s | Rise Real Estate | WZMH

[ADob]

Sure, but we pay what we pay here because that's what the market's like. They pay what they pay there for the same reason. Each of us should be able to expect a decent product at whatever price our particular market can bear.

 

[IanO]

I meant Vancouver (city proper) never gets the 4-6 storey buildings that are crap with materials like cheap paneling.
They know how to do low rise, but my point and yours is that people paying twice as much expect better.

Don't fool yourself. They have plenty of 4-6 wood/wood-concrete examples and certainly some use Hardie or other architectural panels.

Commercial has a bunch, Arbutus area, W4th, more further south too.

 

[AntonK]

Don't fool yourself. They have plenty of 4-6 wood/wood-concrete examples and certainly some use Hardie or other architectural panels.

Commercial has a bunch, Arbutus area, W4th, more further south too. for Commercial or W4th I can’t think of even one example of a new build that’s like

Vancouver has lots of older buildings with Hardy board/siding reclads, but very few if any new buildings that are like the one in this thread, and definitely not on streets like commercial or W-4th.
I don’t have any issue with wood builds in general, but rather the exterior materials used in many of our inner city builds.

 

[constance_chlore]

Most of the design choices are poor architectural decisions rather than purely cost savings. I see alot of these new builds with overcomplicated designs on the exteriors.

@archited gets alot of crap on here, but he's right about how poor the architecture is. Look at the difference between the two wings of Westrich's West Garneau. Why they didn't just replicate the East side?.. Who knows.

This is what kills me. There are so many buildings where removing weird patches of color or other bizarre half-assed ornamentation would instantly improve a building (by making it bland rather than ugly). I realize that the economics are a factor, but I think a lot of developers active in Edmonton also just have poor taste.

 

[David A]

This is what kills me. There are so many buildings where removing weird patches of color or other bizarre half-assed ornamentation would instantly improve a building (by making it bland rather than ugly). I realize that the economics are a factor, but I think a lot of developers active in Edmonton also just have poor taste.

I sort of understand the cheap and bland relationship if for no other reason because it is often easy to do little. However I don't understand the extra effort that often has to be put in to make something ugly. Are these people blind?

 

[ADob]

There is this fear of the perfectly legitimate blank wall, which is definitely superior to the hodge podge they choose instead. I'm with y'all: why? Whyyyyy?

 

[Jhawk]

It’s both cost and design choices. I’m noticing that so many of our 6 storey wood frame buildings are crap, in particular so much cheap paneling. Calgary gets those also, but not as much, and Vancouver never gets that kind of stuff.

Most wood frame builds in Calgary and Edmonton aren’t much different. In general builds in Calgary will splurge a bit more for brick than in Edmonton, but for the most part they are similar.

Aside from material costs, it’s also the types of buildings. Calgarys downtown builds are almost all concrete highrises. Vancouver’s the same but with better materials. You never see buildings like this proposed in those downtowns.
It’s gotta be because people paying paying more expect more.

Yes this is true. Higher sales or rental prices have an effect on concrete builds. Someone in this thread previously said that construction costs in Calgary were higher than Edmonton, but for concrete there’s no real difference, but there’s a substantial difference in sale or rental prices.
Edmonton units fetch lower prices and concrete builds in Edmonton these days aren’t pencilling out. Calgary developers are still able to work the numbers and that’s why there’s a lot more of it..

 

[NicolBolas]

Most wood frame builds in Calgary and Edmonton aren’t much different. In general builds in Calgary will splurge a bit more for brick than in Edmonton, but for the most part they are similar.

Yes this is true. Higher sales or rental prices have an effect on concrete builds. Someone in this thread previously said that construction costs in Calgary were higher than Edmonton, but for concrete there’s no real difference, but there’s a substantial difference in sale or rental prices.
Edmonton units fetch lower prices and concrete builds in Edmonton these days aren’t pencilling out. Calgary developers are still able to work the numbers and that’s why there’s a lot more of it..

To be fair both Vancouver and Calgary are arguably better ran cities in general. Edmonton goes from one 4 year term of mismanagement to the next, this also contributes to the race to the bottom for architecture and infrastructure.

 

[Jhawk]

One thing I forgot to mention with regards to concrete builds is for rental towers it’s partly about rent prices, but more importantly about what the developers think the building will be worth in 10 or 15 years. Higher rents and strong demand over a long term make the buildings worth more.

 

[HelpEd]

To be fair both Vancouver and Calgary are arguably better ran cities in general. Edmonton goes from one 4 year term of mismanagement to the next, this also contributes to the race to the bottom for architecture and infrastructure.

What social problems does Edmonton have these 2 cities don’t? Or better yet except for marketing what have they done better?

No one looks down on Edmonton quite like people who live here. You’ve got folks in St. Albert and Fort Saskatchewan who wear it like a badge of honour that they never have to go downtown or even into the city. Then there are others who complain that Edmonton is boring, yet never show up to any festivals/ events. At the end of the day, this is a marketing problem. Edmonton doesn’t have issues that other cities don’t also have.

 

[archited]

^ Well put... and to add there are people on this very site who regularly disparage the City. That fact baffles me -- why waste your time here if every place "not Edmonton" is better than?

 

[ADob]

Guilty as charged on recent negativity, but I also do love this city and have come back here over and over again from other places I've lived. It's home. And it does have a lot going for it.
Re: @HelpEd 's comment, I have met many people who said there's nothing happening in Edmonton whereas I found that there was way more happening than I had time or energy for, in terms of events, festivals, smaller concerts. When they said nothing is happening, they usually meant that not enough BIG NAME BANDS showed up and if it wasn't in the Journal or Sun, they didn't know about it and didn't care.
I do think we have so much good here. It's frustrating when our own low expectations keep tripping us up and we could do/be so much more.

At this point, if we move it won't be because of the city. It'll be because of the Alberta government, and that fact pisses me off to no end.

 

[Agard]

I really can't believe this design every time I look at it, it would be disappointing in Grande Prairie or Yellowknife, but in Edmonton it's just insulting

 

[archited]

Guilty as charged on recent negativity,

I was not thinking of you at all in terms of "Ed-Neg". Your comments are always well balanced and thoughtful and a pleasure to read. We certainly don't want to lose you to "the other" -- I believe the current Alberta Gov. is going to die on its own sword -- the waiting game is nearly over... hang in there.

 

[ADob]

From your mouth to god's ears, @archited !
If we do leave, it won't be soon. And thanks for your kind words.